NBN take up = 16%

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Super Nova
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Re: NBN take up = 16%

Post by Super Nova » Mon Oct 04, 2010 6:55 pm

Jovial Monk wrote:5. All Telstra's copper customers.

Wireless sucks. It can never approach the bandwidth of FTTH. That seems to threaten some people who seem to have become wedded to wireless and see the NBN as a threat instead of a HUGE opportunity. Then again, the dinosaurs once ruled the earth, but not since tens of millions of years ago tho. Good old Deepshit is proselytizing wireless—from his ADSL2 connection! bwahahaha!

PS the Cameron govt is introducing a FTTH scheme for the UK. FTTH is where real bandwidth is at.
Monk,

I have to disagree. The forecast for wireless communications and the ongoing advancement in technology make wireless a very attractive solution. Wireless has changed our lives (or at least those with it). Your phone is now a computer capable of doing amasing things. the world will eventually become a wireless either for communications. It is cheaper with only larger pipes going to the communication hubs for wireless. Now for our country residence it is a problem however but over time they too will see the benefits.

The solution is not fibre to every house. The solution is to allow the ecconomics of innovation and demand to play out. If you need fast comms now, with todays technology and you choose to live at the back of Burke then you have to wait or pay. Telstra would be happy to put in a leased line to your community with truck loads of capacity if you are prepared to pay. otherwise you have to use what is currently on offer. If your business needs include a huge internet capacity, there are many ways to meet that with today's technology.

The nanny state knowing what is best, spend shet loads of our money is always a waste. NBN should not be implemented when the benefits are so unclear. It is picking a winner that will not be a winner. The rapid change of technology in the space is very fast. Pick an old style solution and throwing money at it is never going to be a good result.
Always remember what you post, send or do on the internet is not private and you are responsible.

Jovial Monk

Re: NBN take up = 16%

Post by Jovial Monk » Mon Oct 04, 2010 8:51 pm

Garbage! Wireless cannot deliver bandwidth! Despite advances in theoretical speeds these are never everyday speeds. It is incredibly difficult to get more towers built so as more and more are forced onto wireless due to degradation of the Telstra copper network wireless speed drops more and more.

Wireless is a complementary service but not a main one. the next big internet thing is TV over IP. Wireless cannot handle this, fibre can.

I live in the inner suburbs and because of pair gain my choices are wireless or dial up. Fuck that, roll out the NBN!

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IQSRLOW
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Re: NBN take up = 16%

Post by IQSRLOW » Mon Oct 04, 2010 8:59 pm

Maybe you should actually pay for a decent service instead of wanting to get one handed to you at everyone else's expense
http://www.cn-c114.net/583/a545072.html
Huawei, a leader in providing next-generation telecommunications network solutions for operators around the world, today announced the successful deployment of its 42Mb/s Dual Carrier HSPA+ solution for PCCW, Hong Kong's premier telecommunications provider.
Telstra already has this up and running but let me guess, a tight old skinflint like you has probably paid for a Dodo or Vodafone account thinking that it should be the ducks nuts.

Like everything, you get what YOU pay for. It's only the retards that think they should get what EVERYONE should pay for. Socialist scum

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Super Nova
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Re: NBN take up = 16%

Post by Super Nova » Mon Oct 04, 2010 9:18 pm

Jovial Monk wrote:Garbage! Wireless cannot deliver bandwidth! Despite advances in theoretical speeds these are never everyday speeds. It is incredibly difficult to get more towers built so as more and more are forced onto wireless due to degradation of the Telstra copper network wireless speed drops more and more.

Wireless is a complementary service but not a main one. the next big internet thing is TV over IP. Wireless cannot handle this, fibre can.

I live in the inner suburbs and because of pair gain my choices are wireless or dial up. Fuck that, roll out the NBN!
Monk,

When you referto towers you are thinking current technology. There will be a revolution in wireless technology going well beyong 3G mobile phone techology of today. When it comes it will be IP based and a large either. It will work for all mobile devices, phones, PCs, fridges, cars ...etc. It will require points of presence everywhere. Everywhere is everywhere. When this comes the fixed infrastructure will just be there to support it.

What we do with our current spectrium will be an issue. That will require a big rethink. We use nice clean spectrium for old technology. The capacity to carry huge volumes of data across the spectium will change the way everything works when it comes to comms. They are working on this now. Will it be here tomorrow, no, will it be here in 10 to 20 years... yes. Why spend so much money on old junk for the next 10 years only to have it made redundant the moment it is realised. That is the point. Why waste the money... our money on a winner that is by design going to be the loser.

Also if we spend so much money on an elephant there will be lttle political will to recognise the failure and slow adoption of the new protocols ...etc further placing Australia behind the world. We should be invovating at the edge of the future not implement the stoneage technology of the past.
Always remember what you post, send or do on the internet is not private and you are responsible.

Jovial Monk

Re: NBN take up = 16%

Post by Jovial Monk » Mon Oct 04, 2010 9:40 pm

Wireless will never carry huge amounts of data. Never! The signal attenuation and all those boring laws of physics will prevent it. Will work brilliantly in the lab, flop in the real world. And it will be more expensive than FTTH—all the points transmitting need to be backwards connected with fibre. Might as well just wire up the premises instead.

In addition, the amount of EM radiation is already quite high and it would go up heaps more and spark opposition everywhere.

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IQSRLOW
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Re: NBN take up = 16%

Post by IQSRLOW » Mon Oct 04, 2010 11:27 pm

Wireless will never carry huge amounts of data. Never!
Here's Monks mobile. He still thinks it is current :roll:
Image

Wireless will advance to the point it will carry huge amounts of data...guaranteed. All these NBN labor licking arsesacks try and base their arguments on the tech staying stagnant which is has never done.

Stop licking labor sack and spending money that would be better spent elsewhere

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Super Nova
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Re: NBN take up = 16%

Post by Super Nova » Tue Oct 05, 2010 1:51 am

Jovial Monk wrote:Wireless will never carry huge amounts of data. Never! The signal attenuation and all those boring laws of physics will prevent it. Will work brilliantly in the lab, flop in the real world. And it will be more expensive than FTTH—all the points transmitting need to be backwards connected with fibre. Might as well just wire up the premises instead.

In addition, the amount of EM radiation is already quite high and it would go up heaps more and spark opposition everywhere.
I think your laws of physics need an update. Also they are looking at inovative ways to carry information which will be a big advance on how we do it today.

EM radiation is not a real issue. (unless you site on the transmiter) We have huge amount of EM that naturally occurs. The only difference now is that some of the spectrum that has been empty is getting filled.
Always remember what you post, send or do on the internet is not private and you are responsible.

Jovial Monk

Re: NBN take up = 16%

Post by Jovial Monk » Tue Oct 05, 2010 3:02 am

So this magic new network will run at 10Gbps?

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Super Nova
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Re: NBN take up = 16%

Post by Super Nova » Tue Oct 05, 2010 4:54 am

Jovial Monk wrote:So this magic new network will run at 10Gbps?
No. I hope you were not expecting that to your door, where you?
Anyway where did you get 10 from. It is 1. "1 Gigabits per second".
A 4G system is expected to provide a comprehensive and secure all-IP based solution where facilities such as IP telephony, ultra-broadband Internet access, gaming services and streamed multimedia may be provided to users.

This article uses 4G to refer to IMT-Advanced (International Mobile Telecommunications Advanced), as defined by ITU-R..

An IMT-Advanced cellular system must have target peak data rates of up to approximately 100 Mbit/s for high mobility such as mobile access and up to approximately 1 Gbit/s for low mobility such as nomadic/local wireless access, according to the ITU requirements. Scalable bandwidths up to at least 40 MHz should be provided.[5][6]

In all suggestions for 4G, the CDMA spread spectrum radio technology used in 3G systems and IS-95 is abandoned and replaced by frequency-domain equalization schemes, for example multi-carrier transmission such as OFDMA. This is combined with MIMO (i.e., multiple antennas(Multiple In Multiple Out)), dynamic channel allocation and channel-dependent scheduling.
4G definitely does not cut it.
A major issue in 4G systems is to make the high bit rates available in a larger portion of the cell, especially to users in an exposed position in between several basestations. In current research, this issue is addressed by macro-diversity techniques, also known as group cooperative relay, and also by beam-division multiple access.[43]

Pervasive networks are an amorphous and at present entirely hypothetical concept where the user can be simultaneously connected to several wireless access technologies and can seamlessly move between them (See vertical handoff, IEEE 802.21). These access technologies can be Wi-Fi, UMTS, EDGE, or any other future access technology. Included in this concept is also smart-radio (also known as cognitive radio technology) to efficiently manage spectrum use and transmission power as well as the use of mesh routing protocols to create a pervasive network.
I think this generation is still not there however I believe this concept will further improve for mobile communications. Now with that said, mobile communication is not the same as wireless like today. You rmobile device would connect to whatever is the fastest path for the communications. So I expect you will get better than you do today with your home Wi-Fi router.
The National Broadband Network (NBN) is a fibre to the premises (FTTP)[1] network under construction in Australia. The Australian government has established a government business enterprise, NBN Co Limited,[2] to design, build and operate an Open Access Network providing download speeds of 1 Gigabits per second[3][4] to 93% of Australian homes and businesses, for which it is offering to contribute an initial cash injection of up to A$43 billion. The remaining homes and businesses will be supplied using wireless and satellite technologies. It will be the largest single infrastructure investment in Australia's history.[5] Work on the rollout in Tasmania began in July 2009 and the first services went live on 1 July 2010.[6] On 20 June 2010, Telstra signed a non-binding agreement to participate in the National Broadband Network rollout.[7]
The NBN proposes to use wireless for that 7% that NBN does not reach. I'm proposing to use wireless for a bigger % until the technolgy is cost effectively available for those it can not reach.
Download speeds of 1000 megabits per second for 93% of Australia homes and businesses[8] using a Gigabit Passive optical network (GPON) or Ethernet Point to Point fibre[9]
The remainder of Australian homes and businesses will be serviced by a combination of next generation wireless and satellite technologies with a minimum speed of 12 megabits per second
Monk, 12 MbPS is plenty fast enough. Why would anyone want more than that. If you need more then you are running a server and should host it in a server room in a data centre that has the right connections. End users and consumers do not need more than this speed in the next 10 years. Bloody hell, I get by on 1 Gbps today and that is plenty fast enough. I would be very happy with 12. remember browser technology is the server doing all the hardwork and just presenting the output to your screen. It is only the comms for the browser that needs to be sent not large databases ...etc.
It will require the creation of 47,000 new jobs over the next eight years and will support 25,000 jobs every year until completed
Now that is the real issue. Job creation scheme using our money. It is a waste of money for sweet FA benefit for the ecconomy in the long term beyond job creation.
Always remember what you post, send or do on the internet is not private and you are responsible.

Jovial Monk

Re: NBN take up = 16%

Post by Jovial Monk » Tue Oct 05, 2010 8:04 am

1Mbps is the current rate, 10mbps is not far away and 100Mbps will not take that long and the new speed just requires new gear at either end, the fibre can carry terabits per second.

12mbps is fast enough? For todays applications maybe altho I bet that it is starting to not be enough but stuff like TV over IP will need more. An advantage of the FTTP is that upload speeds can be a huge percent as fast as can download speeds, unlike ADSL etc.

Wireless, no matter how advanced still needs lots and lots of transmission points which I doubt would be built and they would still be wired back—the NBN could provide that back wiring.

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